How to deal with a climbing estimate?

"Nibbles" (nibbles)
10/26/2016 at 10:42 • Filed to: Houselopnik

We got an estimate for our driveway pour last week and lets just say it was my magic number. We agreed, shook hands, got it in writing and, yesterday, they came by and graded the land and laid the forms. During that work I had to take my cat to the vet. While we were there, I got a call from the contractor:

“Hey, I wanted to let you know that we re-measured after laying the forms and I’m not sure if something was in the way, or if we just missed something, but there’s an extra 400 sq ft I didn’t account for. I won’t charge you for the extra labor but I’m going to need $600 for the extra concrete.”

How the hell am I supposed to deal with this? We went with him on a recommendation and he was the best estimate. This extra cash puts him above some of the other estimates we got but he’s already done a good deal of work. We also don’t have that $600 to toss at him Friday (when the pour happens).

It sucks that his estimate was off but how the hell do you miscalculate by 400 square feet? Should I play Good Guy Steve and get him the extra six bills? Meet him somewhere in the middle? Douchebag Dave it and say “Well we’re paying what’s on this sheet here because this is what we signed off on” and let him eat the total loss?

DISCUSSION (21)

Comes over to help work on your car and only drinks beer > Nibbles
10/26/2016 at 10:49

For me, it would depend on your relationship with him. If it’s just some jamoke you picked up outta the yellow pages, might take the “you estimating wrong is your problem, had your estimate come in $600 higher, you wouldn’t have been in our budget and we wouldn’t have gone with you” path and see where he goes from there, but if it’s a guy you actually know and will have an ongoing relationship with, sit and talk with him.

crowmolly > Nibbles
10/26/2016 at 10:49

A 20x20 section is a lot. Enough that I’d really give him shit about it.

Do the other estimates have measurements in them too? What do they say?

Smallbear wants a modern Syclone, local Maple Leafs spammer > Nibbles
10/26/2016 at 10:51

Well... he can’t stay in business if he gives away free stuff. On the other hand, he can’t stay in business if he makes mistakes like that either.

And how do you “just miss” a 20'x20' area? Sounds like whoever measured went too fast and misread their tape by 10' on the width of the driveway.

Frankly I’d start by telling them that them making a mistake is not your fault and they need to honour their price. If they’re reasonable they’ll swallow it. If they kick, offer to meet them in the middle somewhere on the condition that you pay the difference later on, as you don’t have the money now.

McMike > Nibbles
10/26/2016 at 10:55

Sounds like he’s already trying to meet you in the middle with not charging for labor (if there is any truth in his numbers)

He better get you a new appraisal before he pours a single square foot of concrete though, otherwise, he’ll never be able to collect the extra $600.

Nibbles > crowmolly
10/26/2016 at 10:56

The other estimates have the numbers. The funny thing is he came with the estimate saying “I bet I’m about $1500-$2000 lower than the other guys. That’s because I want your business and you came on recommendation from [another contractor that did some great work for us].”

He was right. $1500 cheaper. Apparently because his estimate was off, not because he wanted the work.

Nibbles > Comes over to help work on your car and only drinks beer
10/26/2016 at 10:57

I think we’ll do this on Friday when he comes over for the pour. I’m half tempted to let my wife deal with it. She’s type A and also an accountant so she can beat him over the head with numbers, where I tend to cave.

CAR_IS_MI > Nibbles
10/26/2016 at 11:00

Im with Crowmolly on this. 400sq ft is a big area to miss.

I would ask him how he missed such a big area. then if he makes up some bull or tries to put it back on you I would say; well, I received several other estimates that were much lower than what you’re attempting to charge me now, and theres no way they all mis-measured, so I will pay you for the work you’ve done and then have one of them come finish the job.

This might backfire and you have to call one of them to come finish the job. But, if he’s trying to swindle you he will back off the extra $600 real quick.

Future next gen S2000 owner > Nibbles
10/26/2016 at 11:01

Make him show his measurements and calculations as to the sq ft area.

That is a big area to be off for a driveway. Your agreement was for the driveway, it is his fault he is off, not yours.

Edit: $600 bucks is a worthwhile cost to eat if it keeps customers happy.

Roadster Man > Nibbles
10/26/2016 at 11:08

You signed a contract. It’s on him to measure things the right way. Don’t give him a dime above the contract price and tell him you already talked to your lawyer (even if you didn’t).

gogmorgo - rowing gears in a Grand Cherokee > Nibbles
10/26/2016 at 11:12

This is a thing I’ve encountered going with the lowest bid, you don’t always get the best and brightest. Except when you sign a contract with the government, you won’t be getting paid any extra. We once had a contractor undercut the next lowest bid by half, and despite our best efforts we couldn’t get them to back out, even though it was obvious from their bid package they had grossly underestimated the task. They insisted they could do it and our policy requires us to go lowest bidder so we signed the contract. They for sure lost a ton of money on that one, plus they didn’t have the right equipment to complete a couple parts of the job safely or within the timeline, so we couldn’t even pay them the entire agreed amount because they couldn’t complete the contract. It sucked cause they were great guys from a small business, but such is life.

At any rate, revisit those papers you signed. If it’s only an estimate, they can probably get away with charging the extra to you. If it’s an actual contract that says they’ll do X for $Y, you don’t owe them anything more than $Y if they’re doing X, no matter how badly they screwed up the estimate.

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > Nibbles
10/26/2016 at 11:23

It’s his fault, he should eat the cost. It’s up to you if you want to throw in some extra money to make it hurt less. He should have said hey I made a mistake measuring so either I pull my bid or I will need an extra $600 to do the job.

haveacarortwoorthree2 > Nibbles
10/26/2016 at 11:25

Still confused — do the other estimates have the same measurements that this guy’s estimates had or do they have more area listed? Obviously, if it’s the same I highly doubt everyone mismeasured, which means this guy is trying to pull a fast one.

Nibbles > haveacarortwoorthree2
10/26/2016 at 11:27

His estimate doesn’t have dimensions written down so I can’t say for sure what he initially calculated.

TheRealBicycleBuck > Nibbles
10/26/2016 at 11:27

If a contractor walks in with the attitude that he can be significantly lower than his competitors, you have to wonder where his savings are coming from. Lower labor costs? Lower overhead? Cheaper materials? Perhaps leaving something out? It may be that he has a habit of underbidding to get the work and then charging extra for things that were “accidentally” left out of the original bid.

The incremental labor costs for an extra 400 sq.ft. are minimal. I’d say hold him to his signed contract and I’d be sure to be onsite when the pour happens to make sure everything is installed correctly and you get what you paid for.

My wife works as an owner representative supervising construction jobs. She has many tales of catching contractors who try to cut corners to save a few bucks.

haveacarortwoorthree2 > Nibbles
10/26/2016 at 11:36

Here’s a personal anecdote, if it helps. Had a pool put in a few years. Picked a company and told them we wanted the all-in price, don’t come back to me for anything else. They quoted a price and I accepted — I specifically told them I’m not going to try to negotiate you down on price because I said I wanted an all-in, no-matter-what price. We’ve got deal, right? The guy agrees. First day of digging, get the call — we discovered that your sewer pipe runs where we didn’t think it would run, so the price is going up. I reminded him of our prior conversation, said they if they wanted to renegotiate the price that we would go all the way back to the beginning. They folded, and did the job as agreed. Of course, I also had a warranty for the pool so I was confident that they couldn’t cheap out somewhere else to make the money back since that could potentially bite them in the ass in a big way later on.

crowmolly > Nibbles
10/26/2016 at 11:43

Sure sounds like he guessed about the amount he needed. Talk to him and see.

I’d say something like “We went with you due to a good recommendation and we had a specific budget that needed to be met. We were pleased with your estimate and service so far, however being off by 400 square feet is not a small error and we are not prepared for the added expense.” Then offer whatever compromise you want.

jminer > Nibbles
10/26/2016 at 12:05

Square feet or cubic feet off? if we’re talking the cost of concrete that is sold by the cubic foot (yard actually).

If it’s cubic feet of concrete it could be simply be that they removed too much ground and need more concrete or there could have been an issue with the ground they didn’t find until they got into it. I’d get more details on why they were wrong.

Here’s the thing though, if you refuse to pay him the new price he will stop work and still bill you. If you don’t pay after the work is done he can legally file a lean on your house. It’s shitty but that’s how it works. An estimate is not a contract for a final price, just an estimate of it, they almost always change.

Nibbles > jminer
10/26/2016 at 12:11

3.5 yards. No ground removed. He said his initial calculations were wrong and that he missed (first it was 14x15, then he said 11x15, then 22x15)

He’s given plenty of numbers to show he fucked up somewhere, he knows it, and just wants to get the job done. He doesn’t know where he missed the footage, but that it was missed.

jminer > Nibbles
10/26/2016 at 12:19

Well it sounds like a contractor that you’re using isn’t trying to screw you, but he might be an idiot. If his job is doing concrete work and measurements were taken inaccurately then that’s trouble, but you’re stuck with him now.

Also if it’s only 3.5 yards of concrete were talking about that doesn’t add up to $6oo around here but I don’t know concrete prices around you. The last time I got a price for ready mix concrete it was about $80 a yard.

d15b > Nibbles
10/26/2016 at 12:51

Piece of advice, friend.

Do not let sensibility get in the way if your partner has a better skillset to deal with the situation.

If you’re going to go hardball, tag the Mrs. in!

TheRealBicycleBuck > jminer
10/26/2016 at 13:04

Agreed. Average price is about $90 per yard plus $60 delivery fee ( http://www.familyhandyman.com/masonry/pouring-concrete/how-to-estimate-a-concrete-order/view-all ).